Episode Description
Few topics impact both our personal and our professional lives as much as healthcare. Yet for so many, it feels like a burden rather than a benefit.
In this episode, host Chris Fredericks is joined by Emily Bopp, Chief of Staff at EV, and Kim Dinwiddie, VP of Human Resources at EV, to unpack the realities of healthcare today and the ways Empowered Ventures is tackling these challenges head-on.
Chris, Emily and Kim discuss the launch of “Healthcare for Us,” a collaborative initiative to transform how we approach healthcare benefits.
They share how they navigate confusing insurance terms and created Healthcare Avatars that reflect their team’s diverse needs. Emily and Kim also share how listening to employees and fostering open conversations drive meaningful change.
In this episode, you’ll learn:
- Reframing Healthcare Benefits as a Partnership: Emily and Kim share how Empowered Ventures redefines healthcare benefits through collaboratiron, making it a shared responsibility rather than an isolated decision.
- Understanding the Evolving Landscape of Insurance: Kim explains the shift from employer-covered benefits to employee-driven choices and how this impacts how people engage with healthcare.
- Simplifying the Complex World of Healthcare: Emily introduces “Healthcare for Us,” an initiative that demystifies insurance terms and creates tailored profiles to meet the diverse needs of employees.
- The Role of Employee Ownership in Shaping Culture: Emily and Kim highlight how the employee ownership model fosters open communication and empowers employees to take an active role in healthcare decisions.
Jump into the conversation:
(00:00) Introduction to Emily Bopp and Kim Dinwiddie
(02:20) Emily and Kim’s one-word reactions to health insurance
(03:27) Kim’s reflection on the evolution of healthcare benefits and employee perceptions
(06:33) Emily discusses the shift from healthcare as a benefit to a necessary challenge
(09:32) The Healthcare for Us initiative: creating personas to meet diverse employee needs
(12:21) How Empowered Ventures listens to employees to guide healthcare changes
(17:21) The cultural shift: building a collective mindset to “lean into healthcare together”
(18:53) Advice from Emily and Kim on transforming challenges into opportunities through collaboration
How to Listen or Watch
Listen below or wherever you listen to podcasts.
Watch below or @Empowered_Ventures on YouTube.
Read the full transcript below the media links.
Episode Transcript
Chris Fredericks: Welcome to another episode of Empowered Owners, the community-building podcast about and for the employee-owners of Empowered Ventures. My name is Chris Fredericks, and on today’s episode, I’m talking with Emily Bopp, EV’s Chief of Staff, and Kim Dinwiddie, EVs VP of Human Resources. The three of us dive into all things related to healthcare and health benefits, what we’re experiencing at Empowered Ventures, and how we’re leaning into the challenges and the opportunities. We introduce an EV initiative that is about six months underway called Healthcare for Us, which is our way to create an environment and a conversation, really, across our family of businesses where we can all lean into healthcare together.
Chris Fredericks: Hi, Emily and Kim. Welcome back to Empowered Owners.
Kim Dinwiddie: Hello. Thanks for having me back on.
Emily Bopp: Hey there. I’m really glad to be back too. And actually, I was wondering if I could spring a question on the two of you. Don’t think too hard about it. Just I’m going to ask it. Get your answer in your head and then we’ll come and you can say what your one-word answer is. Okay, so this is going to be one word. When I say health insurance, what’s the first word that pops into your head?
Chris Fredericks: Expensive.
Emily Bopp: Kim, what about you?
Kim Dinwiddie: Challenging.
Emily Bopp: Expensive and challenging. Yes. Welcome to the life.
Chris Fredericks: Starting off on a good note for sure.
Emily Bopp: Well, that’s what we were hoping to talk about today. Chris, thanks for pulling us here together. Yeah, a lot of challenges going on when it comes to healthcare. Maybe we could talk about those first. What are we facing, guys?
Chris Fredericks: Yeah, obviously I think this is such an important topic for all businesses. So I mean, what we’re facing is a challenging thing that matters to all of the people we work with, our colleagues, our families. An issue that touches everybody, that including businesses because businesses play such a big role in the health insurance and world in the United States. So it’s such an interesting, fascinating, scary, huge topic. Why don’t we try to figure out an approach to solving it is something that I think we’ve all been thinking a lot about, you know, lately.
Emily Bopp: Yeah. And so Kim, I was just wondering from your perspective, having been in HR for your whole career, why are the challenges these days different?
Kim Dinwiddie: So I think it’s interesting. I’ve just watched it evolve over time to now. I feel like we’re in a situation where insurance is just something that happens to people. They just think, okay, well I need it. The employer is going to give me some choices. I’m in a box and I have to choose based on what they are giving me. I’m just going to take 15, 20 minutes to do that and I’m not going to think about it again until next year. And unless I use it then, you know, I obviously start thinking about it then.
But I feel like it’s just a matter of a feeling like people can’t change it. It’s out of their control. It’s just happening to them. It used to be early on employers covered 100% so people didn’t have to really think about it. Right. It’s something free that was given to them. Then employees started paying for it and they realized, oh, this is getting really expensive. And then just out-of-pocket costs have risen too.
But still that mindset of it is what it is and it’s happening to me.
Emily Bopp: That’s really curious, Chris. Can you think back at a time where the benefit stopped feeling like a benefit from your perspective as a CEO? I mean, is that what is happening now? Like, is that the challenge?
Chris Fredericks: Yeah, I think it’s felt the same at least in my career. I mean it’s felt similar the whole time. I remember when I came out of college and got my first job in an accounting firm and yeah, it was like I get to pick from two plans and it’s this much money and exactly what Kim said. I just didn’t think about it again, you know, all year unless I needed it. And so as a, I guess I’m thinking back as a young person at the beginning, I wouldn’t even say that it felt like a benefit because before that I was on my parents’ plan and that was also for free. So it almost feels weirdly normal to just like, transition from a being covered by your parents in some fashion to getting free. It’s really weird. Like, I’m now thinking about the fact that when I first transitioned to paying for my own car insurance, I actually was like, wait a sec, what is this? Like, how does this work? Why am I paying $1,000 a year, $600, whatever the number was for car insurance back then? You know, it’s like, how did deductibles work? How does this work? Like, all of a sudden, I care because it’s no longer my parents paying for my car insurance. I’m actually paying for it. And so that. That really, to me, makes this really clear and stark, the difference in how it feels to engage with the actual insurance product itself.
Emily Bopp: That’s a really interesting point. I think that being a purchaser of health insurance, like Kim, you were saying, we all just feel like it’s happening to us. Like we don’t really have a choice. And yet to opt out and not be covered at all seems really irresponsible. Because what if? Just in case. But then how to go about buy. It’s not like you really have a choice. It’s not like anything else that we buy.
That’s a challenge that’s probably always been there. I would say maybe the reason why we’re feeling it more now is because it’s getting so dang expensive.
Kim Dinwiddie: And as you asked about feeling like a benefit, I think it’s interesting from an employee’s perspective because it used to be a big deal when you put it on, like, the total compensation statements and everything. And now people are like, yeah, but I know this is a benefit to me, but it really is. Yeah, Shifting. And there was a time where people had to have coverage. If you didn’t have coverage, there’s preexisting conditions. But then that went away. But people are still, like, kind of in this box, though, of not even knowing what options may be out there.
Emily Bopp: Challenges. So your two words were expensive and complicated. Was that yours?
Kim Dinwiddie: Challenging.
Chris Fredericks: What about you, Emily? What if we would have asked you the same question? What would you have said?
Emily Bopp: I would have said, too hard. That’s two words. But it just feels too hard. Why is it so hard? Why is it hard to understand? Why is it hard to use? Why is it hard to pay for? It’s just too hard. As a company. Challenges like, we’re kind of facing for the first time as empowered ventures, as a family of businesses, we’re facing some challenges that we’ve never had before.
Chris Fredericks: I think as a company, as a whole enterprise and all of our businesses, the challenges we face are the typical ones. The expense, the complication, trying to find that way to support our people in this challenge as well. It’s a really personal topic. So I think companies rightly are we too rightly tread a little lightly. We don’t want to be telling everyone exactly what they should do with their personal life even though it has such an impact on this topic. So it’s a really challenging thing for a business, for our business to know exactly what the best approach is and partly because there’s so many different types of people in our enterprise, they use these products differently. And maybe that’s an interesting rabbit hole to go down a little ways is I think you both have been thinking about that kind of how do people use this differently? I’m curious, what have you learned as you’ve been spending some time on that topic?
Kim Dinwiddie: Well and it’s interesting when we talk about the different industries that we’re in but all the generations that we have also which hit so many people related HR related thing that healthcare now I think really needs to be a topic of all the different generations that we’re working with and it was interesting. So as we have been asking folks, you know, just tell us what’s top of mind when we say healthcare to you and such a wide variety from yeah I just I have it because I have to to I’m still my parents insurance I don’t really think about it to yeah I know what my expenses are and I want the most coverage and you know, the best coverage. So it is all across the board of what people are are really looking for and wanting for themselves.
Emily Bopp: Yeah I where my mind went. So this is jumping a little bit to what we’re doing about some of these challenges. But hey, let’s go there. So we are kicking off really an initiative that probably will be with us into perpetuity called Healthcare for Us. And that’s a big title for a lot of different things going on under that hood. One of those things is to try to distill some of these either generational or just preference approaches to how people interact with the healthcare system. Distill those into some categories, some avatars like the general people. So Kim, I’m trying to remember who our people are.
We’ve got the keep it simple person. We’ve got the only one necessary person. We’ve got the I’m not sure about this person and then the out ahead of it person. So we’ve got these four sort of general profiles that are. It’s really helpful for us to think through that lens again as an employer, to your point, Chris, trying to support our people, really trying to understand the breadth of what that means and get our arms around various philosophies and, you know, personal preferences as people approach this topic so that we can be diligently addressing all of the sort of disparate preferences and needs even, you know, within each of those. So, yeah, that’s where my mind jumped to.
Chris Fredericks: Yeah, I’m super excited about that. Everything you just said, I think makes me so happy and excited that when we do engage this topic going forward, and I’m sure these Personas will probably evolve too as we go forward, but as the ones who are not just us four, but like those of us who have the opportunity to engage like the insurance company directly and things like that, and be the ones that ultimately are fostering help influencing like what options we’re even putting on the table ultimately or things like that. Having this opportunity to have these people in our mind, like specifically in mind is what really energizes me because it is easy to just lose track of how will this impact this type of person, that type of person, this other type of person. And so one of the points I think one of you made earlier, the complexity and our. What we’re trying to challenge for our company and for any company is to try to simplify this topic, which by definition means only having one or two or three plans instead of the universe of possible approaches. But how can one or two or three plans be best for hundreds of people in there? So I’m so happy that that’s one of the first steps we’ve taken, is to try to. What are, what other steps have we taken to just try to understand our people and what’s on their mind when it comes to this topic?
Kim Dinwiddie: When I think it’s. It’s asking the question, what’s on what is on your mind? And having them pause for a minute and say, huh, yeah, what barriers might I have? What do I love about the healthcare that we have? Or what may be missing or what’s top of mind for me and my priority, and I think by listening to their voice and finding out what really resonates with them is how that change can happen. Because a lot of times, and through no fault of any employer, but it’s almost been more of like a, we want to motivate you to take care of yourselves and make Good decisions based on your health and your family’s health. And so we’re going to, you know, make these plan design changes or we’re going to make these premium changes which are all fantastic. But I think we’re at the point now where so many levers have been pulled, there’s no more to really pull to make a significant difference. So how do we listen to them? How do we present some resources and education to them that really resonates with hey, yeah, this is me and this is what I typically face or maybe I might face in the future. And huh, what does that mean? What decisions can I make to make an impact in my health or make a difference in my out-of-pocket expenses or. But really just getting that fire to start, you know, kind of sparking a little bit, I think that that will be impactful when we get to that point.
Emily Bopp: I love that. And that is my hope through really a conversation that begins that healthcare. To your point earlier, Kim, it’s something that people think about for 10 or 15 minutes and they make their decision and then they move on and so much can get lumped into that. It’s not just your benefits decision, but it’s everything about how you interact because it’s just been made so opaque. But anyway, to be talking about it, to just be asking the questions, maybe being asked is the first time that it sparks someone to even be considering and to be thinking about it. And then that thought is like, oh wait, now we’re talking about this again. And it leads to another thought and then, you know, there’s sort of a snowball. That’s what we hope is a snowball effect where healthcare starts and health benefits to kind of bifurcate the two.
But healthcare and benefits starts to be a topic around the water cooler. It starts to be something that we are empowered to talk about. So actually to answer your question, Chris, another thing that we’re really excited about is just some basic, I hate to say education. That word sounds so dry and makes my own eyes glaze over, but actually we have a really cool way to demystify like all the words that trip us. Premiums, co-pays, deductibles, co-insurance, out-of-pocket max, family out-of-pocket max, PPO versus HCHP. Like all the words we’ve got a really cool way to make that all lock in and make sense. Hopefully maybe for the first time. I know it did for me.
I didn’t know what all those words I couldn’t have rattled off to you. You know, how do those into Play. And now having created a way for us to engage that I can. And I’m hoping that the rest of our ers will be as well. So, my goodness, then we have a common vocabulary that can interface with a system out there that uses the same common vocabulary. And now we can actually start having thoughts and talking about it again. I think it’s just making it a thing that’s not invisible, that’s not sidelined and relegated to a few leaders to deal with every year. But this is hours.
Like, we can own this too, collectively.
Chris Fredericks: I love that it’s making me think about insurance as a product with features that we can engage with. Almost like that first time you get a complicated device, like your first time I got a smartphone. And at first it’s like, I have no idea how to use this thing. I don’t know what the features are. And it takes time and you have to dig in and you have to try things. And there’s an element of just engaging with it and to understand what you can do with this product. And really, insurance is no different. It just feels so scary and overwhelming until maybe with support, you learn to lean in and be a little uncomfortable and go through that learning process, which is always uncomfortable.
Just learning anything new is. It can be a little scary. But it’s exciting to imagine a world where all of our people are feeling like, oh, yeah, I get it, I understand how this works. And, yeah, that’s really cool.
Kim Dinwiddie: Well, and Chris, and you said it, lean in. And I think that’s the other piece of this is we’re really wanting this to be part of our culture, is lean into healthcare with us. This isn’t something that’s happening to you. This isn’t something that there’s a few people who are making these decisions and know what’s best for everyone. It’s not. It’s truly a partnership, collaboration. It’s all hands on deck. You know, to really see this through is there’s going to be a lot of change, I think, coming over the next few years, many years.
Health care is going to look different, insurance is going to look different. And starting now, just leaning in and, you know, having us all walk together is going to be great. And I think that’s really the message that we are hoping just to get everyone on board with. Like, that’ll just be roll off the tongue as part of who we are, we all lean in to healthcare together.
Chris Fredericks: That’s awesome. What you said must be amazing because the sun just came out and just came behind me. So Right. While you’re in the middle of saying that, someone really liked that point you just made, I think a really exciting opportunity here. I love your features analogy with a new iPhone. A really exciting opportunity here is that we get out ahead of it. People have been saying for a long time that healthcare is in a major state of disruption and. Yeah, but we’re still kind of at the beginning of that. And so if we can learn the features of the current version, it’s going to make it so much easier to ride the changes of the features coming out in the subsequent versions and for all of us to be able to be on board with that. Yeah, Kim, lean into healthcare with us. That’s our message for all of our EVers.
Emily Bopp: That’s our message to ourselves. Like, this is hard, but we’re doing it and we’re actually starting to have fun doing it. It’s like anything else. And being able to, again, get out ahead of it and be able to interact with those changes as they come collectively. Super exciting. So while it’s a huge challenge, on the other hand, the opportunity here is enormous for us to do really well by ourselves and all of our people and make something really exciting.
Chris Fredericks: That’s so true. That’s awesome. I’m so excited. Any last thoughts before we adjourn on this one?
Kim Dinwiddie: I think it’s going to be exciting how all of this plays out. I think it’s going to be a game changer, to be honest with you. I think by collaborating, leaning in everybody within EV, that’s something that most groups haven’t done, they’re afraid to do. Because I’ll tell you, there’s some hard conversations that happen when you do this. It’s very vulnerable. But when you have the right people and everyone wants to be a part of it, I think is going to really produce some fantastic results and maybe some very creative things in the future that we aren’t even aware of yet.
Emily Bopp: Let the future come. We’re. We’re ready. We’ll flow with it. That’s so cool. Thank you, Kim.
Chris Fredericks: Agreed. Thank you both for your effort so far to move us forward on this topic. And like I said, I’m excited. Thanks for coming on Empowered Owners to share a little bit about where we’re at and how we’re seeing the future for Empowered Ventures and healthcare. So thanks, Emily. Thanks, Kim.
I hope you enjoyed that conversation with Emily and Kim. Empowered Owners is a podcast by and for the employee-owners of Empowered Ventures. Special thanks to share your genius for producing. You can find show notes and transcripts on our website at empowered.ventures. Full video episodes are on YouTube @Empowered_Ventures. If you have a question for us about EV, our companies or employee ownership, contact us at [email protected]. You can also text or leave a voicemail at 317-643-2383. Thanks for tuning in.
